Custom Scales - using Ableton scales plugins on keyboard??

The Sequential Prophet-6 Analogue Synthesizer

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bradwebercdn
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Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:59 pm

Custom Scales - using Ableton scales plugins on keyboard??

Post by bradwebercdn » Wed Oct 28, 2015 12:02 am

Hi there,
I would like to be able to disconnect the use of the keyboard from the rest of the synth in order to use midi scales plugins in Ableton.
Is this possible?
In a sense I'd like the keyboard to act as a standalone midi controller sending midi data into Ableton, receiving a custom Scales plugin and then sending it back to the Prophet6 and being able to use the Proph6 controls as I would normally.

Does this make sense? Is this possible? Thanks!
Last edited by bradwebercdn on Wed Oct 28, 2015 6:55 am, edited 2 times in total.

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LA Keys
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Re: Custom Scales - using Ableton scales plugins on keyboard??

Post by LA Keys » Wed Oct 28, 2015 4:30 am

Short answer: NO

Explanation: Midi by itself doesn't support scales, just "basic" notes information (based on equal temperament) . The instrument itself (virtual or hardware) is then responsible to produce the "note" that will sound based on the midi note received. Or simply said midi can just say "play a C", this is the instrument itself that will play a note of the correct frequency based on the scale selected "internally" (or via a plugin). The said frequency of the note cannot be transmitted via midi, rather just as a "C" for this example.

LA

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BobTheDog
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Re: Custom Scales - using Ableton scales plugins on keyboard??

Post by BobTheDog » Wed Oct 28, 2015 6:49 am

Yes, just turn local control off on the P6.

Set the Midi In on your Live midi track in live to the P6 and midi out on the track to P6.

Set the Track Monitor to IN, add the midi scale plugin and off you go.

bradwebercdn
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Re: Custom Scales - using Ableton scales plugins on keyboard??

Post by bradwebercdn » Wed Oct 28, 2015 6:53 am

But then I can't play with any of the parameters on the P6. The Prophet is stuck on the exact settings before I turned local control off.
Unless there's a way to turn local control off on the keyboard only and not the rest of the unit? (Doesn't seem to be as far as I can tell).

Other Options would be...
1. Use an alternate midi keyboard, load up a scales plugin in Ableton and then play that scale entirely on white notes on that keyboard and have it play through the Prophet. Was just hoping there was a way to do it on the prophet keyboard itself.

2. download custom scales online for the Prophet that I can load up via SysEx. Anyone know where to find these, or guide me through creating them, if it's not too difficult. Thanks!

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LA Keys
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Re: Custom Scales - using Ableton scales plugins on keyboard??

Post by LA Keys » Wed Oct 28, 2015 4:51 pm

Again, you CANNOT send scale back to the P6, midi is not supporting this (for any keyboard)

:!:

Your only option is to use the downloadable scales for the P6, from the dave smith website.

LA

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BobTheDog
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Re: Custom Scales - using Ableton scales plugins on keyboard??

Post by BobTheDog » Thu Oct 29, 2015 7:59 am

LA Keys wrote:Again, you CANNOT send scale back to the P6, midi is not supporting this (for any keyboard)

:!:

Your only option is to use the downloadable scales for the P6, from the dave smith website.

LA
No I am correct and you are wrong.

You totally misunderstand the original question. Do you know what the midi scale plugin in Ableton Live does?

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BobTheDog
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Re: Custom Scales - using Ableton scales plugins on keyboard??

Post by BobTheDog » Thu Oct 29, 2015 8:12 am

bradwebercdn wrote:But then I can't play with any of the parameters on the P6. The Prophet is stuck on the exact settings before I turned local control off.
Unless there's a way to turn local control off on the keyboard only and not the rest of the unit? (Doesn't seem to be as far as I can tell).

Other Options would be...
1. Use an alternate midi keyboard, load up a scales plugin in Ableton and then play that scale entirely on white notes on that keyboard and have it play through the Prophet. Was just hoping there was a way to do it on the prophet keyboard itself.

2. download custom scales online for the Prophet that I can load up via SysEx. Anyone know where to find these, or guide me through creating them, if it's not too difficult. Thanks!
The parameters on the P6 should be changeable with Local Off and the data being echoed back to the P6 from live, the only thing that may not work is patch changeing.

Make sure you have Param Xmit set to "nr" and Midi Control set to "nr" on the P6

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LA Keys
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Re: Custom Scales - using Ableton scales plugins on keyboard??

Post by LA Keys » Thu Oct 29, 2015 2:48 pm

BobTheDog wrote:
LA Keys wrote:Again, you CANNOT send scale back to the P6, midi is not supporting this (for any keyboard)

:!:

Your only option is to use the downloadable scales for the P6, from the dave smith website.

LA
No I am correct and you are wrong.

You totally misunderstand the original question. Do you know what the midi scale plugin in Ableton Live does?

I stand corrected. BobThe Dog appear to be right as I didn't realized what the plugin was really doing...

:oops:

LA

bradwebercdn
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Re: Custom Scales - using Ableton scales plugins on keyboard??

Post by bradwebercdn » Sun Nov 01, 2015 2:58 am

BobTheDog - thanks for the help!

there's a little quirk i noticed... i have to start the P6 with midi control on and the rest of the parameters as you've stated... then once i've chosen a sound, THEN turn midi control off and it works perfectly with the scales plugin! I can even change patches no problem.
amazing!

sleepwalker
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Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2011 8:39 pm

Re: Custom Scales - using Ableton scales plugins on keyboard??

Post by sleepwalker » Sat Dec 12, 2015 12:51 am

Yeah. It's kind of a bummer. I want Local OFF for the keys only.

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