Bank/Tens select Software update !!

The Sequential Prophet-6 Analogue Synthesizer

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Cymon66
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Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by Cymon66 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 8:34 pm

Hi Guys

Really sorry you didn't update a simple but so useful feature of the earlier Prophets.... Allowing a simple number advance cycle by continually pressing the Bank select and Tens select respectfully.. Its a real pain the way it is and it would make program change so much easier, especially for live work !

Simon

Rooftree
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by Rooftree » Fri Aug 07, 2015 8:13 pm

I'd like to see something like this too. Browsing through presets takes a long time with the present number entry method. It would be so much easier if I could hit a button (or buttons) to move to the next highest (or next lowest) patch.

Pym
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by Pym » Fri Aug 07, 2015 8:37 pm

I really doubt this will happen, although I see the advantage of it. I'll think about a simple way to implement it but no promises
Chris Hector
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blewis
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by blewis » Sat Aug 08, 2015 12:59 am

Press and hold Hundreds then press Tens to increment? (Gesturing right)

Press and hold Tens then press Hundreds to decrement? (Gesturing left)

blewis
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by blewis » Sat Aug 08, 2015 2:27 am

Just checked the manual to see if that double button combo was taken. The silk screen already says "Incrment" over Tens and "Decrement" over Hundreds.

Perfect! :-)

Pym
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by Pym » Sat Aug 08, 2015 8:24 pm

That's the most likely option I think
blewis wrote:Press and hold Hundreds then press Tens to increment? (Gesturing right)

Press and hold Tens then press Hundreds to decrement? (Gesturing left)
Chris Hector
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drxcm
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by drxcm » Sat Aug 22, 2015 3:59 am

This would be a lovely update to see.

goldphinga
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by goldphinga » Fri Sep 04, 2015 6:27 am

Indeed it would!
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austex78704
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by austex78704 » Tue Sep 22, 2015 5:35 pm

I realize it adds a computer layer, perhaps anathema to an analog hands-on beauty like the P6, but I'm now a huge fan of the Soundtower librarian. It allows you to batch, catalog, save, and very conveniently scroll through presets using the up and down keys on your keyboard. soundtower.com

Pym
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by Pym » Tue Sep 22, 2015 5:52 pm

Thought about this quite a bit more...

There are two different cases where more direct program selection is useful:

1. Browsing through presets where up/down is useful
2. Selecting a preset instantly during a performance

After thinking about it a lot, I realized that ultimately #2 is far more important to performers than number one. If you don't have to skip through presets during recall you avoid a lot of odd behavior with the delays and param changes during the interim. Given that I'm more inclined to have bank+tens start a preset recall mode where you can type in the 3 bank+program numbers to instantly select the next preset. You would still be able to do this with one hand (holding bank+tens locks it into the mode) and then recall the preset of your choice, hitting bank or tens to cancel.

Although this does limit the inc/dec behavior to select presets I think during a performance people will be very happy it exists in such a simple fashion. Going to think about it some more and see if I can implement
Chris Hector
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blewis
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by blewis » Wed Sep 23, 2015 2:29 am

But wouldn't performers who care about switching quickly between presets either:

1) save 10 of them next to each other so they instantly access them (reserve 10 patches per song for instance)
or
2) use MIDI to send PCs?

I'm sure you've thought about it a lot. I'm not trying to be argumentative, just thinking out loud. Casual browsing is probably low, but there could be 1000 patches on this thing and DSI doesn't provide any patch manager. I patch browse all the time. Part of buying the synth is buying 500 ideas from pros.

But if someone already has to remember what patch 123 is vs patch 489, I don't know why they wouldn't save them to be co-located or have some MIDI strategy for having a machine to remember patch 123 is the chorus and patch 489 is the bridge. I can't imagine having to hit Bank|Tens then type 489 to switch between a chorus and a bridge. Doesn't seem like that is practical so I'm not sure why you'd facilitate it. I don't think I can use that for anything in my current project. If I could, it'd be managed by MIDI footswitch anyway if it's that important or patches would be next to each other (10 patches per song)

Saves one keystroke for worst case? Bank+Num+Tens+Num+Num vs Bank|Tens+Num+Num+Num (both read 5 strokes, but the last is just one less stroke). But as you mentioned, most importantly is not having erroneous sounds/reverbs/delays going mad.

The Increment/Decrement would allow someone to mindlessly blow through patches quickly with their eyes closed without thinking of numbers at all.

Just my thoughts. Some numeric management system is the onus of the user though. No way around it. Either spreadsheets, moleskin, phone camera, or patch co-location, or some MIDI manager. No one can remember from last night that patch 367 was the killer one from last night without some tool. (increment/decrement does't help there either BTW)

Not sure why making the most human memory intensive way to manage patches should be the selected operation of the two choices you've presented.

What do your performers/endorsers/pros think think? I'm just some dude after all.

yellow_roast
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by yellow_roast » Fri Oct 23, 2015 8:14 pm

Pym wrote:Thought about this quite a bit more...

There are two different cases where more direct program selection is useful:

1. Browsing through presets where up/down is useful
2. Selecting a preset instantly during a performance

After thinking about it a lot, I realized that ultimately #2 is far more important to performers than number #1
That's great you are thinking of "performers", but I'm only in the studio so would prefer the patch increment/decrement function.

The good news is you don't have to think about it at all, you have all us users you can poll to find out what most of the users want, rather than what you personally guess will suit the one group of "performers" better.

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Strange Quark Star
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by Strange Quark Star » Fri Oct 23, 2015 10:21 pm

yellow_roast wrote: The good news is you don't have to think about it at all, you have all us users you can poll to find out what most of the users want, rather than what you personally guess will suit the one group of "performers" better.
Doesn't quite work that way. A poll like this would in no way be representative of the "average" user, after all, how many Prophet owners are on this forum? Only the most technical/internet-savvy ones. And what they like and want is not necessarily what's best for the majority of users.
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Pym
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by Pym » Thu Nov 19, 2015 8:02 pm

I have heard your concerns and added a function so you can inc/dec select programs:

hold bank and hit tens to inc
hold tens and hit bank to dec

One handed quick operation and not too hidden

It will be in the first beta release after we do our production release
Chris Hector
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drxcm
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by drxcm » Sat Nov 21, 2015 3:28 am

Thanks Pym, that's great news!

blewis
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by blewis » Sat Nov 21, 2015 1:21 pm

Is there a Like button anywhere? Thanks Pym.

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Domatron
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by Domatron » Tue Jan 05, 2016 12:47 pm

Pym is the man.
Synths

GBP
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by GBP » Tue Jan 05, 2016 4:44 pm

Nice, but... When will that new beta appear?
I'd be ready for it. :)

Sofine
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Re: Bank/Tens select Software update !!

Post by Sofine » Tue Apr 05, 2016 5:58 pm

blewis, late to the game and all that, but, I don't know if you were instrumental in persuading Pym to implement this, but I appreciate this feature and I thank you for your articulate and concise post!

Hats off to Cymon66 too for starting the thread and the initial suggestion :)

Cheers,

Simon
blewis wrote:But wouldn't performers who care about switching quickly between presets either:

1) save 10 of them next to each other so they instantly access them (reserve 10 patches per song for instance)
or
2) use MIDI to send PCs?

I'm sure you've thought about it a lot. I'm not trying to be argumentative, just thinking out loud. Casual browsing is probably low, but there could be 1000 patches on this thing and DSI doesn't provide any patch manager. I patch browse all the time. Part of buying the synth is buying 500 ideas from pros.

But if someone already has to remember what patch 123 is vs patch 489, I don't know why they wouldn't save them to be co-located or have some MIDI strategy for having a machine to remember patch 123 is the chorus and patch 489 is the bridge. I can't imagine having to hit Bank|Tens then type 489 to switch between a chorus and a bridge. Doesn't seem like that is practical so I'm not sure why you'd facilitate it. I don't think I can use that for anything in my current project. If I could, it'd be managed by MIDI footswitch anyway if it's that important or patches would be next to each other (10 patches per song)

Saves one keystroke for worst case? Bank+Num+Tens+Num+Num vs Bank|Tens+Num+Num+Num (both read 5 strokes, but the last is just one less stroke). But as you mentioned, most importantly is not having erroneous sounds/reverbs/delays going mad.

The Increment/Decrement would allow someone to mindlessly blow through patches quickly with their eyes closed without thinking of numbers at all.

Just my thoughts. Some numeric management system is the onus of the user though. No way around it. Either spreadsheets, moleskin, phone camera, or patch co-location, or some MIDI manager. No one can remember from last night that patch 367 was the killer one from last night without some tool. (increment/decrement does't help there either BTW)

Not sure why making the most human memory intensive way to manage patches should be the selected operation of the two choices you've presented.

What do your performers/endorsers/pros think think? I'm just some dude after all.

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