Kissin Moog sub37 CVs from Pro 2 and vice versa

The Dave Smith Instruments Pro 2 Analogue Synthesizer

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nielsd
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Kissin Moog sub37 CVs from Pro 2 and vice versa

Post by nielsd » Wed Feb 10, 2016 7:47 pm

Sorry, but i'm a beginner with analog modular synths signals.

It would be nice if i could connect my Pro 2 and sub 37 (Moog) over their CVs for further experiments. But while the Pro 2 has 3,5" jacks for CV and gate, the Moog seems to have larger jacks (RCA or similiar). I assume the voltage ranges are different too?

Is it possible to connect them by and simple plug adaptor (and CV bias / offset settings)?

Secondly, i've read somewhere it is possible to feed the DSI Tempest with CV over pedal jack. Which adaptions are required in settings and or adaptors if connecting to Pro 2 CV or sub37 CV?

Do i have to sold some special cabling or is it just non sense what i wrote here?!?

many thanks,

Niels.
Niels Dettenbach
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Re: Kissin Moog sub37 CVs from Pro 2 and vice versa

Post by soundxplorer » Thu Feb 11, 2016 2:07 pm

Cable adapters will work great, no problems there. I find it is easiest to work with 3.5mm cables and put a 1/4" adapter on one end, instead of doing it the other way.

CV from any synth is compatible, the only consideration might be the range of the voltage - for example I think the Pro 2 can output up to a +10v signal, but Moog might recommend a range of up to +5v for their synth. To stay within that range when sending CV out from the Pro 2, just keep the Amount parameter in your modulation routing set to half or less (a value of 63 or below). The Moog might be fine with higher voltage too, but better safe than sorry.

The really cool thing with the Pro 2 is that you can mix CV signals by assigning more than one modulation to the same output. You can get some really crazy stuff going on.

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Re: Kissin Moog sub37 CVs from Pro 2 and vice versa

Post by nielsd » Thu Feb 11, 2016 2:54 pm

Cable adapters will work great, no problems there. I find it is easiest to work with 3.5mm cables and put a 1/4" adapter on one end, instead of doing it the other way.
Ahh,
thought in the same direction and still fetched some Doepfer 3,5" cables in different lengths for that - will sold some 1/4" jacks on it or add adaptors i have somewhere around from headphones (stereo, but should do it too i think).
The Moog might be fine with higher voltage too, but better safe than sorry.
This is a major point for me - i did not want to "brick" any of the devices just by overfeeding it with any "incompatible" CV - i.e. by switching it randomly.

I've read from the sub37 manual that the CV inputs could be used for pedals to (and if i remember the circuit of the shruti self build synth the CV pins could be driven by pots with grnd and +5 on both ends).
The really cool thing with the Pro 2 is that you can mix CV signals by assigning more than one modulation to the same output. You can get some really crazy stuff going on.
sounds cool (it seems the sub37 is a bit limited here byself where the pro 2 could bring in new "dimensions") - will definitly give it a try... ß)

thanks you very much,


Niels.
Niels Dettenbach
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Re: Kissin Moog sub37 CVs from Pro 2 and vice versa

Post by nielsd » Sun Feb 14, 2016 9:27 pm

Hiho,


now i've folded some cables which seem to work so far.

Pls correct me if i'm wrong here anywhere or something could be done better in any way.

Otherwise: may be someone other that helps a bit...

To connect both machines in connected:

Code: Select all

CV Out 1	->	Pitch CV
CV Out 2	->	Filter CV
CV Out 3	->	Volume CV	

Gate Out	-> Key Gate
But it seems it is not possible to get the volume and/or gate cable connected all the time and be able to play on the sub37 "alone" (even if the Pro 2 is on and providing the defined CVs). It would be nice to have any way by configuration that any CV cables could leave in and use it by config only (i know that CV cabling is usually another philosophy then "software config"...).

and adapted voltages (before!):

Pro 2 global:

Code: Select all

CV Scale 1: 0 (used for pitch CV)
CV Scale 2: -64
CV Scale 3: -64
CV Scale 4: -64
This should scale down to the half range of 0-10V (0-5V) for 2-4 while the scale for Pitch is 1V/Oct on both machines.

Then in my personal ini/preset (mod matrix):

Code: Select all

DC:			-59	->	Ext CV Out 1
Note Num:	127	->	Ext CV Out 1 (note pitch)

DC:			127	->	Ext CV Out 3 (volume)
This set down the voltage of 10V to 5 V by a (around) -5V offset while the Note number is bringing +1V/Oct onto the voltage.

It seems i require -59 instead of -64 ("half" of -127) to get the same frequency ranges between notes (i.e. when playing notes span a octave).

This seems to work so far.

To get both machines synced while Pro2 is the "master" i cabled them by a DIN MIDI from Pro2 to sub37:

Code: Select all

MIDI Out 2/Through	->	MIDI IN
and on Pro 2 i set in globals:

MIDI Clock Mode: Master
MIDI Clock Cable: MIDI Port 2

and on sub37 set

send clock: off

to get them synced both together independently from usage on any DAW, but still have to check how far this works with my DAWs (i.e. when my DAW is sending start/stop to this and other MIDI devices like the TEMPEST and Evolver here)...


best regards,


Niels.
Niels Dettenbach
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Re: Kissin Moog sub37 CVs from Pro 2 and vice versa

Post by soundxplorer » Wed Feb 17, 2016 4:27 pm

nielsd wrote: But it seems it is not possible to get the volume and/or gate cable connected all the time and be able to play on the sub37 "alone"
I think this is just how Moog designed the CV inputs. I used to have a Little Phatty a few years ago, and from memory I think it acted the same way. Whenever a cable was plugged into the Gate input it seemed to override the local control from the keyboard, like the jack was half-normalled. I also remember that if you left the other end of the cable empty then it would hold the Gate open all the time, an easy way to get the Little Phatty to drone out continuosly. At least that's how I remember it working.

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Re: Kissin Moog sub37 CVs from Pro 2 and vice versa

Post by nielsd » Sat Feb 20, 2016 8:13 pm

I also remember that if you left the other end of the cable empty then it would hold the Gate open all the time, an easy way to get the Little Phatty to drone out continuosly. At least that's how I remember it working.
yes, thank you,
have the same effect - it seems to me there is any switch in the jack or the (very low?) capacity of the cable is stepping in there. Confused me a bit...

I've found some preset related settings allowing the control of the gate, pitch and volume sources by software now ("keys", "external", "both") and will try to play with it in the next, but as preset related settings any preset /init has to adapted as far is i understand. For me it would make more sense if the default is "keys" if "external" is a synonym for the CV currents.

I have the current beta firmware for the sub 37 from moog (1.1.20) - not sure if this is in the stable / public version too. If the software editor / librarian allows to set this as "default" or global this would be nice - but i assume this may "break" their backward compatibility (if my ideas makes any sense so far...ß).

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